House and Senate leaders held such a meeting on Thursday morning. But when a News & Observer reporter tried to enter, they barred him.

Senate Majority Leader Tony Rand, a Fayetteville Democrat, could not cite a reason under the public meetings law why a reporter would be excluded. But he said the meeting had nothing to do with the budget.

"Because we were just hearing a report from staff," Rand said. "It had nothing to do with negotiations."

He said the report was an "economic briefing."

What did it say?

"We're not sure."

Why can't a reporter listen to that?

"Because we're trying to determine if there's something we want to do," Rand said. "I mean, that was just a staff thing."

Related to the budget?

"Related to anything."

Budget negotiators were the only ones attending. A glimpse into the meeting showed Dan Gerlach, senior budget adviser to Gov. Mike Easley, and legislative fiscal workers addressing the lawmakers.

Gerlach left several minutes later.

What were they meeting about?

"Talking about the budget," Gerlach said as he walked away.

After the meeting broke up, Rep. Mickey Michaux, a Durham Democrat and the House's chief budget writer, said his team had nothing to do with the decision to close the meeting.

"They ran you out of there," he said of the Senate budget negotiators. "That was their meeting. It wasn't mine."

The budget is expected to be more than $21 billion for the coming year. It affects nearly every North Carolinian by virtue of money spent for schools, pay and benefits for state workers and teachers, and public safety.

But much of it is being put together behind closed doors. Republicans, who are in the minority, and advocates of open government have been especially critical of the process.

Lawmakers apparently got some bad news at the meeting Thursday. Officials acknowledged later that lawmakers may have $70 million less to spend in the coming fiscal year, because sales and income tax collections are not meeting estimates.

Fiscal experts for the legislature and the Governor's Office had estimated the state would have $151 million in tax collections from the current year that could be made available for next year's budget. But since then, revenue has slowed, causing them to lower the estimate to roughly $80 million.

It's not a lot in a budget expected to exceed $21 billion, but House and Senate budget writers were already struggling to reach an agreement. The possible loss of $70 million doesn't make the negotiations easier.

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